Thanks for thoughtful comments Ben! Agreed on all points, and fixing the
editing of code that is also being modified programmatically has been on my
todo list for… quite some time. I imagine following your second solution,
and disabling problematic displays of state during editing. I’d also like
to provide the option of editing either the original, user-entered data, or
the data in its current state after any programmatic transformations that
may have occurred. Which editing mode is employed could depend on something
simple like shift-clicking the data to begin editing, or a key command.
Andrew, I’ll mention that if a similar random transformation existed in
Gibber (or at least the version used in the essay), the values it generated
would be displayed in a comment next to the function call rather than
performing inline editing of the function arguments; this seems more
appropriate to the semantics (to me). But perhaps the more important point
you’re getting at is that this is all really messy, and you'll get no
arguments from me there. - Charlie
PS - I tried sending this a couple of hours ago but it didn't seem to make
it through; my apologies if you all receive a duplicate.
On Thu, Jan 31, 2019 at 12:32 AM Ben Swift <ben_at_benswift.me> wrote:
> Yes, that's an important distinction - one which I perhaps didn't make
> as clear as I could have.
>
> Cheers
> Ben
>
> andrew_at_moso.com.au writes:
>
> > Sure, although it is important to distinguish the semantic issues from
> the
> > practical issues. Both are harmful, but in different ways - and the
> practical
> > issues tend to be more obvious.
> >
> > Andrew.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: "Ben Swift" <ben_at_benswift.me>
> > Sent: Thursday, 31 January, 2019 2:41pm
> > To: "livecode" <livecode_at_we.lurk.org>
> > Subject: [livecode] Re: interactive essay on annotations /
> visualizations in
> > live coding
> >
> >
> >
> > Yep - *I* certainly still think of it as [c e g] with a random
> transformation
> > -
> > especially since the order does have some semantic meaning (when I hear
> a C
> > major triad in my mind's ear, I hear it in root position, arpeggiatted
> > upwards).
> >
> > I think it's just a subset of the bigger challenge, though - which is
> > having annotations which at worst aren't harmful when the code is
> > executing and being edited simultaneously, and at best are even
> > beneficial in that situation.
> >
> > Cheers
> > Ben
> >
> >
> > andrew_at_moso.com.au writes:
> >
> >> Hey Ben,
> >>
> >> Something that I've always questioned about inline editing is this:
> >>
> >> Let's say you have a cell of some kind - let's say [c e g] - and then
> you add
> >> a 'live transformation':
> >>
> >> random([c e g])
> >>
> >> Do you really think of the cell as [e g c] and [g e c] and ... Or do
> you
> >> think of it as the cell [c e g] with a 'random' transform. In which
> case
> >> changing [c e g] inline just seems incorrect to me. i.e. it's a
> question of
> >> intention.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Andrew.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: "Ben Swift" <ben_at_benswift.me>
> >> Sent: Thursday, 31 January, 2019 10:52am
> >> To: "livecode" <livecode_at_we.lurk.org>
> >> Subject: [livecode] Re: interactive essay on annotations /
> visualizations in
> >> live coding
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi Charlie
> >>
> >> Thanks for putting this out there, I had lots of fun poking around with
> the
> >> examples.
> >>
> >> I've jotted down some thoughts in response here:
> >>
> >>
> http://benswift.me/blog/2019/01/31/on-livecoding-annotations-and-visualisations/
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Ben
> >>
> >> Charlie Roberts <bigbadotis_at_gmail.com> writes:
> >>
> >>> Hi everyone,
> >>>
> >>> I've been meaning to send this essay to the list for a while; It
> provides
> >>> interactive examples of the annotations and visualizations used in
> Gibber /
> >>> gibberwocky to display the current state of patterns and function
> output.
> >>> Currently works in Chrome only... any feedback would be appreciated!
> >>>
> >>> https://charlieroberts.github.io/annotationsAndVisualizations/
> >>>
> >>> - Charlie
> >>> _______________________________________________
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Received on Thu Jan 31 2019 - 05:36:49 GMT