I am not active really at all in this scene, but i do keep up with what
people are doing and I really enjoyed the streams from the last ICLC.
I did want to pop in and say a few things though.
I'm pretty sure that the intention behind the original suggestion was in no
way to keep the conference exclusive or elitist or anything. It most likely
comes from a real sense of growing concern for
the environment. I'm not sure how much this concern is registering across
the world, but in the UK right now it is an increasingly visible issue. Of
course its easy to ignore personal responsibilities to
reducing this and place the blame at the foot of governments and industry,
but its still worth taking the time to think how comfortable you are with
your contribution to global emissions etc
http://www.theprogressmotive.org/one-flight-can-burn-through-your-annual-fair-share-of-carbon/
I know quite a few people who will refuse to fly to conferences simply on
this principle. Of course this is easier to say for someone who has already
done their fair share of flying around/career forming
in the past (and hypocritical too) but its still worth thinking about.
>From the area I practice in, GDC is the biggest annual conference and is
held in SF(USA) every year. Recently it has come under scrutiny because its
location is deemed to restrict access for lots
of practitioners based in other locations around the globe. It is also to
be honest quite frequently a case where you will fly there and see the same
people every year (and in many cases, if you live in a major city or in the
UK, some of the same people you live near at home). One response to this
has been to try and set up distributed conferences and local equivalents.
This also helps local scenes develop and get a sense of their own identity
and contributions. Siting a conference in a physical location (even if
different each time) will always exclude some people due to
geography/expense. Having elements of local / distributed hubs can only
help to create a better network. I dont have any real answers for this, but
I am sure it is being suggested with the best intentions.
On Tue, 30 Apr 2019 at 18:34, Ogborn, David <ogbornd_at_mcmaster.ca> wrote:
> I am no longer on the committee but I think it is important to note in
> connection with the issue of geographic balance that I don’t think there
> have typically been many proposals to host ICLC. This is not surprising -
> as currently structured it is a big commitment, and the intersection of (a)
> experience with organizing anonymous peer review of research + (b)
> availability and experience with performance venues + (c) past experience
> with ICLC specifically, is small (but growing!).
>
> A distributed conference could assist in this regard because it allows the
> conference to take place in hubs that can be in different parts of the
> world, without the full responsibility of (a) (b) and (c) being borne in
> any one place immediately. My experience is that (b) is pretty easy in many
> places, but that (a) and (c) are much less equally distributed.
>
> -D
>
> > On Apr 30, 2019, at 1:12 PM, Mauro <lavaramano_at_gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Oh, just in case: the previous message was with the best intentions,
> > i'm not pointing any fingers or accusing anyone of conspiring against
> > non-EU places (?).
> >
> > Saludos,
> > Mauro
> >
> >
> >
> > On 4/30/19, Mauro <lavaramano_at_gmail.com> wrote:
> >> i agree with Sarah.
> >> To me it feels like "yeah sure, you're invited to the party. you
> >> celebrate at home but you're totally invited to the party."
> >>
> >> probably Norah Lorway was talking about something else, but i've been
> >> feeling like this about "the livecoding scene": same thing over and
> >> over again.
> >> """
> >> just because there is a code of conduct for your music/tech event
> >> doesn't always = inclusive. stuff gets cliquey and gatekeeper-y very
> >> fast, with the same people doing the same stuff. Just saying.
> >> """
> >> https://twitter.com/norahlo/status/1115761385407954944
> >>
> >> what i'm trying to say is: "the livecoding scene" feels european and
> >> perhaps north-american, and that's it. sure, i could celebrate ICLC in
> >> Arg, but why would i bother doing that when I could just simply do it
> >> any day.
> >> if you're thinking in making the conf accesible think about moving the
> >> conf to other places outside the places mentioned above.
> >> for example: Joanne's experience in BA
> >> here's a twitter thread:
> >> https://twitter.com/joannnne/status/1115921660228636672
> >>
> >> i'm not saying that this is an easy task or that you should move the
> >> conf to BA, but consider that there are other places, and the people
> >> will definitely show interest in the topic.
> >>
> >> On 4/30/19, Sarah Groff-Palermo <sarah.groff.palermo_at_gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Looking at this from my geographic vantage, any place I go is going to
> be
> >>> a
> >>> long flight if it's not just going to be the same people I could see
> >>> anyways. So I would rather have the most possible people when I get
> >>> there.
> >>> That seems like it will be the case for most of the Americas, really.
> >>>
> >>> At the same time, there are even fewer visualists that music-focused
> >>> people, which means splitting up hurts us even more. It was so huge to
> in
> >>> Spain to be able to really spend time with other visuals folks.
> >>>
> >>> I know this is just one perspective and I can see some of the points of
> >>> competing ones, for sure, but personally, it would be a big and
> >>> disappointing change.
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Apr 30, 2019 at 12:37 PM Evan Raskob <evanraskob_at_gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> I thought that what David just wrote was the idea? No that people
> >>>> couldn't
> >>>> travel, but there would be more (maybe closer) places to travel to?
> >>>>
> >>>> There's always the risk of having too many hubs an splitting up he
> crowd
> >>>> too much, but given how widespread the community is an how
> >>>> hard/expensive
> >>>> it can be to travel halfway around the world it seems like there could
> >>>> be
> >>>> a
> >>>> few more local hubs?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Tue, Apr 30, 2019 at 5:01 PM Ogborn, David <ogbornd_at_mcmaster.ca>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Perhaps people still could travel to particular hubs though, if they
> >>>>> want
> >>>>> and are able? Even for those who want to get out of their local
> scene,
> >>>>> they
> >>>>> might then have a choice of where they would like to go for the
> >>>>> conference.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -D
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Apr 30, 2019, at 11:50 AM, Sarah Groff-Palermo <
> >>>>> sarah.groff.palermo_at_gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I don't think preemptively deciding for people that they shouldn't
> >>>>> travel
> >>>>> is best for our community. It is a lot easier when you live in Europe
> >>>>> than
> >>>>> elsewhere to say "don't fly but you'll still meet people."
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Leaving aside all the arguments about whether individual action is
> even
> >>>>> a
> >>>>> plausible response to the crisis, I think letting people choose how
> >>>>> they
> >>>>> want to offset their travel is reasonable.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Scenes are already incredibly insular; I would hate to see the one
> >>>>> mechanism that seems to exist to push at that disappear.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Tue, Apr 30, 2019 at 11:19 AM Evan Raskob <evanraskob_at_gmail.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Is it worth taking this discussion to the new forum, alex? It seems
> >>>>>> like
> >>>>>> it might be better for conversation.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Tue, Apr 30, 2019 at 4:13 PM Alex McLean <alex_at_slab.org> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Sure, but this is an existential crisis.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I agree though that cultural exchange is important, and potentially
> >>>>>>> part of the solution rather than problem. So we have to be
> >>>>>>> imaginative
> >>>>>>> and practical in coming up with something that fits best for our
> >>>>>>> community.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Tue, 30 Apr 2019 at 15:47, Sarah Groff-Palermo
> >>>>>>> <sarah.groff.palermo_at_gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Eh, honestly, I can see the people in my city all the time. While
> I
> >>>>>>> understand the reasons, I'd be pretty disappointed with a
> distributed
> >>>>>>> ICLC.
> >>>>>>> To me the whole point is to meet the bigger community.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Tue, Apr 30, 2019 at 10:39 AM Tom Karches <tkarches_at_gmail.com>
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Going along with this should be an effort to encourage
> >>>>>>> geographically local groups to form. Which makes the entire
> community
> >>>>>>> stronger. Local community is important.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Tom
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> On Tue, Apr 30, 2019 at 3:40 AM Alex McLean <alex_at_slab.org>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Anyone interested in hosting a 'hub' as part of a future,
> >>>>>>> distributed
> >>>>>>>>>> edition of ICLC? The idea being to reduce impact on the
> >>>>>>>>>> environment
> >>>>>>>>>> and make the conference more accessible to people who can't
> >>>>>>>>>> afford/spare the time for long haul flights. Should be a lot
> >>>>>>>>>> easier
> >>>>>>>>>> than hosting a whole ICLC.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Let me know if you'd like to join a discussion exploring this
> >>>>>>>>>> idea
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> cheers
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> alex
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>> blog: http://slab.org/
> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>> Livecode mailing list -- livecode_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to livecode-leave_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>> Tom Karches
> >>>>>>>>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/tomkarches/
> >>>>>>>>> tkarches_at_gmail.com
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>> Livecode mailing list -- livecode_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to livecode-leave_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>> Livecode mailing list -- livecode_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to livecode-leave_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> blog: http://slab.org/
> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>> Livecode mailing list -- livecode_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to livecode-leave_at_we.lurk.org
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>> Livecode mailing list -- livecode_at_we.lurk.org
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> >>>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> Livecode mailing list -- livecode_at_we.lurk.org
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> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
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>
> _______________________________________________
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>
--
Tom Betts
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Received on Tue Apr 30 2019 - 18:08:38 BST